The only real thing SB was missing to be PURE PvP

[Override]

imo the only thing that would be played in the end ( except banes ) = Thieves and scouts...
and scarse they are indeed...
imagine this then ... a full world with thieves and scouts where you cant pickpocket anybody that would be not as fun as supposed to be i guess ...
the game is already more interesting if they would only allow 1 account/pc, so the majority wont be albe to multibox for evacs, therefor the loot and the agro would be more when you pvp/pickpocket. Auction house would deal with the shouts/spam in SDR , so i find that not a bad id.
I find it pretty nice to cut of some safezones, like for example the one on oblivion runegate, or the safehold on mael...

[Zergs]

Originally Posted by Blasphemous

And this is my point. The fact is there has to be one or more central trading points in the game, making these areas prime real estate for thieves. Would it be boring then? There are always ways to be safe, but it makes players think about what they are doing.

To me they are not boring because lack of things to steal or kill...

[Blasphemous]

Originally Posted by Override

imo the only thing that would be played in the end ( except banes ) = Thieves and scouts...
and scarse they are indeed...
imagine this then ... a full world with thieves and scouts where you cant pickpocket anybody that would be not as fun as supposed to be i guess ...
the game is already more interesting if they would only allow 1 account/pc, so the majority wont be albe to multibox for evacs, therefor the loot and the agro would be more when you pvp/pickpocket. Auction house would deal with the shouts/spam in SDR , so i find that not a bad id.
I find it pretty nice to cut of some safezones, like for example the one on oblivion runegate, or the safehold on mael...

You might be right that that would be how it started and everyone would play theives and scouts, but eventually the newness would wear off, the need for trade would be necessary, and people would have to start doing things differently. It couldn't stay like that. Nothing would ever get done. And in games that have implemented stealing in cities, it didn't work like that either. It's not like people wouldn't adapt to there being theives around. Opportunities would be relatively infrequent, which would drop the number of thieves down dramatically. It would be speed of the theif vs. speed of the potential victim to get the trade over with and the speed of the victim to get the goods into the bursar. I had virtually no problems in UO because you learn how to deal with your environment. The benefit is that the possibility is there and caution has to be used in EVERY situation.

[Zarae]

Originally Posted by Faethor

People may not avoid pvp as you claim but how many people in SDR are afk evac bots? I do not like that they can have evac bots just sitting there with no way to kill them.

That's an issue with being summoned out of combat. In any case, plenty of people park their evac bots in their own guild cities.

Also Zarae, you were sarcastic about people playing thieves and scouts more. Why even have a thief class when you can't really steal? Seriously, how about we give thieves a chance to be something resembling a thief and a chance at being a real threat.

L2P thief IMO. Get out into zones and guild cities and there's a plethora of victims ripe for the picking. You're starting to come across like "I want to be lazy, teleport into SDR and steal from people at the vault", because your premise that thieves have a hard time stealing anything is completely ludicrous.

[Override]

Originally Posted by Blasphemous

You might be right that that would be how it started and everyone would play theives and scouts, but eventually the newness would wear off, the need for trade would be necessary, and people would have to start doing things differently. It couldn't stay like that. Nothing would ever get done. And in games that have implemented stealing in cities, it didn't work like that either. It's not like people wouldn't adapt to there being theives around. Opportunities would be relatively infrequent, which would drop the number of thieves down dramatically. It would be speed of the theif vs. speed of the potential victim to get the trade over with and the speed of the victim to get the goods into the bursar. I had virtually no problems in UO because you learn how to deal with your environment. The benefit is that the possibility is there and caution has to be used in EVERY situation.

How you explain it and how i understand it : The risk for playing another class then scout/thief would be result into quick death or being ripped off all the time ( can believe that will have a funfactor in the not-being-ripped-off side ). Eventualy people would go tired of that and A) stop playing B) play a scout/thief also in regular/constant base, and that would be A) less people on the server, less to steal from, less action -> boredom -> "infinity loop" B) not so fun because it will be a scout/thief showoff and people want versatil things thats why SB is epic overall the rest. All of this having thoughts in the back of your head that you prolly would play singleaccount, the overplayed fotm/foty would be thief/scout. Also on single account : the loot will be greater, the oportunity for pickpocketing also including the fun. OK, in UO it was a different story, full open loot, but then again, there was only one back in the days... and that was UO, so eventualy you cant resemble if people would have stayed or left because of that ( maybe im seeing this wrong , i dunno, but thats my opinion)

[Zaphire]

Originally Posted by Blasphemous

And for those saying we need a "safe place to trade", listen to what you are saying and do your Carebear-Stare in a different direction

I need a "safe place to park my evac bot" if OPP is coming back

[Nuncio2]

I'm actually with Blas on this one. I think noob island should be safe, but everywhere else....

[Tego]

In my opinion shadowbane offers enough hardcore PvP. Especially new people need some place where they can stay and communicate with out having their level of frustration raised. Noob Island doesnt allow for this long enough.

Just because shadowbane is somewhat in the hardcore pvp niche, it doesnt mean we have to take it to the extremes.

If you consider that to be carebear, great...That means we're talking about the definition of the word "carebear". In the end this kind of view would lead to a game with no safe zones, lootable equipment, stats/level deranking on death, no guilds (because that means helping each other, so it's carebear!)... etc.

Sounds great for some really hard core griefers, but even in shadowbane those would only make up for a very small part of the population. They also need someone to grief... well.

[Garetheis]

Originally Posted by Blasphemous

No one was ever jailed for stealing or attacking in town. If you got caught by the guards, you were insta killed (which is gay) or chased (which is good). Listen, I used to be a pretty decent sized seller of stuff on eBay from UO pre-Trammel, and I had to deal with theives trying to jack my **** that I was giving to my buyers that was worth more than they had ever seen in the game, while I was transferring it. But you know what it did? The WHOLE WORLD was dangerous. You were never really safe, and man, that was badass. You just have to watch your back. Isn't that what SB is supposed to be about?

Hardcore is hardcore. If SB isn't hardcore, just let me know and I'll shut up

i remember going to jail many times, like one time i released many grizzly bears in a town and they killed every one. don't remember how many it was tho

[xXDarknessXx]

Make all the safe realms open pvp and keep only 1 safezone in the entire map.